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Here it is. No moderates. No compromises. This is home of the Real Americans: the Left. We want change and we want it now!
Pick a topic ye poor sheeple. We're happy to pick apart your mistaken indoctrination into the military-judea-industrial-complex.
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 5, 2009 11:32 AM
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MF is a superstar out here. I'm sure this would be a MF farm if the AC's weren't just here when we bought.
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Edited by editor2 at 11/05/2009 11:15 AM PST
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 5, 2009 11:24 AM
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> Allis-Chalmers (WC series) all the way. There were
> two here at first, a 1934 and a 1952. Now just the
> '52, but it's in use and still a peach.
> --
>
> Knowing good farmers, I believe in good farming, and
> that includes stock management. All I can say on
> this. 
1130 massey- ferguson...smooooooth runner
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 5, 2009 11:18 AM
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Allis-Chalmers (WC series) all the way. There were two here at first, a 1934 and a 1952. Now just the '52, but it's in use and still a peach.
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Knowing good farmers, I believe in good farming, and that includes stock management. All I can say on this.
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 5, 2009 12:15 AM
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If by large scale you mean large farms, true.
If by large scale you mean large production, you and I both know smaller multiculture farms are more efficient as well as more environmentally and economically sound.
Second, cows don't grow on sunshine. They grow on grain. Lots of it. (Even with grass, it takes lots of dedicated farmland.) Everything bad about massive grain production is ten times as true about meat. And that's just getting their food, not counting raising and "processing."
We always had a blue Long. 
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Edited by JaredP at 11/04/2009 9:17 PM PST
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Edited by JaredP at 11/04/2009 9:27 PM PST
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 5, 2009 12:04 AM
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Hmm, not sure. I think I was trying to say that land used for grain (and vegetable) cultivation is currently as subject to the problems of large scale as livestock operations are. Sort of refuting the statement that large scale and monoculture don't go together: they do, almost by definition.
Late for me. Catch you soon.
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Edit: next time, name your favorite brand of vintage tractor, and I'll tell you mine.
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Edited by editor2 at 11/04/2009 9:11 PM PST
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 5, 2009 12:00 AM
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> > Large-scale does not equal monoculture. I am a
> farm
> > boy.
>
> Then Farm Boy knows that if your crop is a grain,
> it's generally large scale today. Nobody buys
> multiple pieces of $400,000 equipment to plant 30
> acres. Yes, there are communities with the farms of
> less than 100 acres, but that is not the farming
> economy: those farmers have off-farm jobs. Scale and
> grain crops go together, one of the lasting effects
> of the farm crisis "get big or get out" push.
>
> --
> Edited by editor2 at 11/04/2009 8:57 PM PST
Yes, bring back the coops. We both oppose the current system and want it broken up to sustainable level multiculture farms. What's your point with that post? It didn't address any of my points.
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Edited by JaredP at 11/04/2009 9:01 PM PST
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 4, 2009 11:55 PM
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> Large-scale does not equal monoculture. I am a farm
> boy.
Then Farm Boy knows that if your crop is a grain, it's generally large scale today. Nobody buys multiple pieces of $400,000 equipment to plant 30 acres. Yes, there are communities with the farms of less than 100 acres, but that is not the farming economy: those farmers have off-farm jobs. Scale and grain crops go together, one of the lasting effects of the farm crisis "get big or get out" push.
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Edited by editor2 at 11/04/2009 8:57 PM PST
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Nov 4, 2009 11:49 PM
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> if allah didnt want us to eat cows she wouldnt have
> made 'em taste like prime rib
Your grasp of the theoculinary aspects of life is always inspiring, J.
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 4, 2009 11:48 PM
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> > Vegetarian is healthier,
>
> Is it? Consider labor exploitation and cruelty
> issues, pesticide use, environmental impact of
> shipping produce cross country--I assume you aren't
> factoring those into the "healthier" equation.
It is. I am.
> I don't want to hear
> > hypocritical animal cruelty rants from a meat
> eater,
>
> Will you accept animal cruelty rants from a meat
> eater who eats locally and sustainably produced meat
> from a small-scale environment? I make that
> distinction.
I recognize the distinction. I also consider it a difference of degree not of kind. Still killing for pleasure. *shrug* However, on my list of moral outrages it's fairly low.
> With ten times as
> > much vegetable nutrients being able to be
> produced
> > for the same amount of resources,
>
> See, that's where the problem of large-scale grain
> farming is just as bad in every respect. This
> produces vegetable nutrients but is also a nightmare.
> Monocrop culture is enormously soil destructive, and
> this is a biggie issue.
I do not disagree. I was talking large scale production as in our food needs. I have argued extensively against our destructive subsidies and monoculture farming elsewhere in this forum.
However. You need ten times as much vegetable production for your burger. Hence ten times worse.
> I consider
> > large-scale meat production immoral on the
> humanity
> > level as well so long as there is hunger.
>
> Think about large-scale vegetable production also.
> The morality issues apply.
We are burning 9 out of 10 vegetables? Because that is what we are doing with our meat production.
Large-scale does not equal monoculture. I am a farm boy.
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Nov 4, 2009 11:42 PM
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if allah didnt want us to eat cows she wouldnt have made 'em taste like prime rib
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 4, 2009 11:39 PM
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> Vegetarian is healthier,
Is it? Consider labor exploitation and cruelty issues, pesticide use, environmental impact of shipping produce cross country, lax supervision of imported products whose production history is vague at best--I assume you aren't factoring those into the "healthier" equation. It isnt only about the effect of food on one individual's personal health. Consider the impact more broadly and you will see health differently.
I don't want to hear
> hypocritical animal cruelty rants from a meat eater,
Will you accept animal cruelty rants from a meat eater who eats locally and sustainably produced meat from a small-scale environment? I make that distinction.
With ten times as
> much vegetable nutrients being able to be produced
> for the same amount of resources,
See, that's where the problem of large-scale grain farming is just as bad in every respect. This produces vegetable nutrients but is also a nightmare. Monocrop culture is enormously soil destructive, and this is a biggie issue.
I consider
> large-scale meat production immoral on the humanity
> level as well so long as there is hunger.
Think about large-scale vegetable production also. The morality issues apply.
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Edited by editor2 at 11/04/2009 8:44 PM PST
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Nov 4, 2009 11:38 PM
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> > > Jesus...shut the fuck up....lets talk
> about
> > this
> > > COMPLETE JOKE of a president that America
> is
> > saddled
> > > with......any independents regeretting
> your
> > vote???
> > > I think SOOO......HHAHAH....4 and out the
> door,
> > > r, should have NEVER been President,
> > UNQUALIFIED!!!
> > > go back to "community organiziing" code
> words
> > for
> > > "lets screw whitey" outta money WE don't
> deserve
> > or
> > > have worked for.....
> >
> >
> >
> > > http://image24.webshots.com/24/4/2/31/308140231ATRaIH_
>
> > ph.jpg" target="_blank">g'mornin paul
>
> His next account name should be something less
> obvious.... like DeleteMe.
is IGNOREMDRUNKASS taken ?
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Re: Is meat the left's ultimate hypocrisy?
Nov 4, 2009 11:33 PM
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> Seriously, we are meat eaters as a species: check the
> teeth we've been sporting for a hella long time.
Omnivorous style, vegetable dominant.
> Small-scale farmers the world over know how to raise
> livestock well and in ways that benefit the soil.
> Because livestock and soil go together, and the soil
> is an irreplaceable resource. Etc etc.
Sure. If it's on that scale. Which is a tiny fraction of current scale, and basically chickens or fish.
> There's no good argument I've heard against meat
> produced sustainably.
Vegetarian is healthier, I don't want to hear hypocritical animal cruelty rants from a meat eater, and it is quite frankly a luxury. With ten times as much vegetable nutrients being able to be produced for the same amount of resources, I consider large-scale meat production immoral on the humanity level as well so long as there is hunger.
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Nov 4, 2009 11:24 PM
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> > Jesus...shut the fuck up....lets talk about
> this
> > COMPLETE JOKE of a president that America is
> saddled
> > with......any independents regeretting your
> vote???
> > I think SOOO......HHAHAH....4 and out the door,
> > r, should have NEVER been President,
> UNQUALIFIED!!!
> > go back to "community organiziing" code words
> for
> > "lets screw whitey" outta money WE don't deserve
> or
> > have worked for.....
>
>
>
> g'mornin paul
His next account name should be something less obvious.... like DeleteMe.
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Nov 4, 2009 11:23 PM
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> Jesus...shut the fuck up....lets talk about this
> COMPLETE JOKE of a president that America is saddled
> with......any independents regeretting your vote???
> I think SOOO......HHAHAH....4 and out the door,
> r, should have NEVER been President, UNQUALIFIED!!!
> go back to "community organiziing" code words for
> "lets screw whitey" outta money WE don't deserve or
> have worked for.....
g'mornin paul
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